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David P. Reichert's avatar

Thanks for the article! One thought:

I don't think "similar to being a human" works well as a definition for consciousness. As you know, the latter is notoriously difficult to define or agree on, but I don't think your def captures what people are trying to get at.

First of all, there's just way too many dimensions of similarity that most people (experts or general public) wouldn't think of as being relevant for consciousness (say, having two hands and two legs). So you'd have to at least get at the notion of "experience" or similar somehow.

Second, if we do invoke experience, this definition seems to beg the question when it comes to "do systems that are different from humans have consciousness". I.e. the whole difficulty of the question is that we are asking it about systems that are different from humans in possibly important ways. If we simply define the term via similarity, we bake in the answer into the definition.

Of course we often appeal to similarly to humans along some dimensions to make inferences about what other systems might have consciousness, but that doesn't imply a priori that lack of similarity implies lack of consciousness, and of course the issue is to figure out which of those dimensions are actually relevant.

The point of Nagel's bat example is that bats have echolocation. Many would find it plausible that bats have consciousness and that they experience echolocation as one of their senses, but if so their experience would be quite different from what human experience is like, at least in that regard. So there doesn't seem anything contradictory to consciousness that is quite alien to us in some aspects (of course, maybe bats are only conscious because they actually are similar to humans in other aspects, but now we're in the nitty gritty of what aspects actually matter... generic similarity doesn't seem like it should be part of the definition).

Sharon Chou's avatar

That fundamental difference between an LLM's mostly 3rd-person Nth-times-removed disembodied aggregate "human experience", and a meat-human's messy un-PC subjective experience gathered largely by direct sensing... still presents an uncanny gap that perhaps stays uncanny for the best.

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